Kernodle: Les Thatcher
was there and the Murnicks were
there. They told me I had to get
all these release papers signed,
where Jim Crockett Promotions
wouldn’t be responsible, the
Murnicks wouldn’t be
responsible, Roop wouldn’t be
responsible, WRAL TV wouldn’t be
responsible…and on and on it
went. You know, if you got hurt
or killed you were on your own
little red wagon.
Bourne: Were they working
that angle, and you were the
first person they let come in to
try him? Or had they been
getting other people for real to
come in and try him?
Kernodle: No, he had beat
everybody else in less than 20
seconds. He’d put them out with
that sugar hold…
Bourne: But they weren’t
pro wrestlers, right? They were
taking people from outside the
business?
Kernodle: Right…this was
for anybody. Anybody could come
in and try to wrestle Bob Roop.
Roop was a great amateur
wrestler from Michigan. And he
also, I’ve heard, was a bronze
medalist in the 1968 Olympics. I
think it was in Greco-Roman
wrestling.
Chappell: Since you
mentioned Roop’s background as
an amateur wrestler, please tell
us a little about your
background in that area.
Kernodle: I had a decent
background in amateur
wrestling…high school and
college. But nothing like what
Roop had, or people like the
Briscos and other really great
amateur wrestlers.
North Carolina had a decent
amateur wrestling program back
then, but it was so far behind
states like Iowa, Oklahoma,
Michigan, New Jersey, New York
and Pennsylvania. Where
basketball around here might be
a great push for amateur
athletes, in those states
wrestling is at the top.
Chappell: Wrestling is
king in some of those areas, for
sure.
Kernodle: When you have
high school wrestling matches in
those states, they’ll sell it
out. They have banners
everywhere! I’ve seen them since
I’ve been in professional
wrestling. When I was wrestling
with [the WWF], we’d go to those
schools and they’d have banners
hanging down with wrestling
championships---year after year
after year.
Chappell: Kind of like we
have for basketball around here.
Kernodle: Right, like
we’d have at the [University of
North Carolina] Dean Dome for
basketball.
So, we had a pretty good
wrestling program, but way
behind places like those I
mentioned that turned out the
great amateur wrestlers.
Chappell: So despite
having a good amateur
background, it sounds like
Crockett Promotions was going to
have you sign your life away, in
order for you to get a shot at
Roop!
Kernodle: Yeah, I had to
sign all those papers! And they
knew what they were doing…they
were holding all the trump
cards. I was sittin’ on the old
maid card, maybe!
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Chappell: So you were
signing all the waivers for the
one match with Roop? You weren’t
promised any other matches?
Kernodle: That’s right,
David. One match…I wasn’t
guaranteed anything.
Chappell: What happened
after you signed all those legal
releases?
Kernodle: They took me up
the steps to the little ol’
dressing room. And as I walked
in, Bob Roop was in there. Only
Bob Roop was in there, and he
was bent over lacing his boots
up. He had those blue Olympic
boots with the rings on them.
Chappell: I remember
them. They looked real nice.
Kernodle: Yeah, they were
really nice ones. I walked in
there and sat down. You know,
they were trying to psyche me
out…
Chappell: You mean having
the dressing room empty, except
for Roop?
Kernodle: Yeah, and they
did a pretty good job of
psyching me out!
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: Anyway, I’m
nervous; I’m scared. I didn’t
know what to expect.
So, when I sit down, I’m only
about ten feet away from Roop as
he’s lacing up his boots. He’s
bent over, and he hasn’t even
raised his head yet.
Chappell: He didn’t even
acknowledge you?
Kernodle: Finally he
raised up his head and looked at
me and said, “You must be the
guy that I’m wrestling tonight.”
I said, ‘Yes sir, Mr. Roop, I
am.’ I walked over to him and
shook his hand and said, ‘My
name is Don Kernodle. This is
nothing personal with you…this
is the only chance I’ve got to
get into professional wrestling,
so I want to try it.’
Chappell: What did you do
then?
Kernodle: I went back
over there and sat down. That’s
the reason it was only me and
him in the dressing room…they
were trying to intimidate me.
Yeah, they were really trying to
psyche me out…which they did!
So then I got dressed and
everything…went down and talked
to some of the wrestlers.
Chappell: Who was there
that night?
Kernodle: Homer O’Dell
was there. Jerry Brisco was
there; Jerry saw all of this.
Johnny Weaver was there. Rip
Hawk and Swede Hanson were
there.
Chappell: That’s an
all-star line up!
Kernodle: Yes! So, it was
time for me to wrestle and you
know, David, nobody really gave
me any encouragement. And you
know, I had aways per se hated
Homer O’Dell…
Chappell/Bourne: (laughs)
Kernodle: You know I’d
seen him wrestle, and I’d seen
him with that cane hitting
Johnny Weaver…
Chappell: That’s
definitely worthy of putting him
on your bad side!
Kernodle: Yeah! But the
one thing that really hit me
good was that I went through the
doors and out to the ring, Homer
stopped me and says, “Kid,
there’s gonna be a lot of people
watching you tonight. You just
go out there and do the best
that you can do.”
Bourne: Really?
Kernodle: Yeah, Homer was
really the only one that stopped
me and tried to give me some
encouragement, and for me not to
worry about the match as much as
I was.
Chappell: You had watched
these wrestlers on Mid-Atlantic
TV for years. What was it like
at that moment walking into the
WRAL ring as one of those
wrestlers?
Kernodle: It was
unbelievable! I don’t know if
you guys ever met Homer O’Dell,
but he was a big man. He was
tall, and he was way over 300
pounds.
So I go out into the ring, and
the lights…the heat from the
lights was tremendous in this
little ol’ studio. I didn’t know
what to do, so I was thinking
about what I saw the wrestlers
do on TV when they came into the
ring. So I just backed up in the
corner, and put my arms up on
the top turnbuckle…like everyone
else did!
Chappell: What were the
stipulations for the match?
Kernodle: The deal was I
had to beat him in ten minutes
or less, to win $2,000. I didn’t
know it, but all he had to do
was wrestle defensively. He
didn’t have to beat me; all he
had to do was keep me from
beating him.
Chappell: Roop certainly
had all of the built-in
advantages.
Kernodle: And I didn’t
know if Bob Roop might jump on
me, and try to kill me! I signed
all those papers. You know, when
the bell rang, I was his!
Well, the bell rang, and lo and
behold I went out there…and I
took him down!
Chappell: I bet that got
his attention!
Kernodle: Then I was
thinking, ‘What the heck do I do
with him now!’
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: I was sort of
lost! I’d never wrestled anybody
that good. I told Mr. Ringley
that I’d wrestled in high school
and college, and I wrestled some
decent wrestlers, but I’d never
wrestled anybody as good as Bob
Roop.
Bourne: Did they have a
ref in the ring, like Angelo
Martinelli?
Kernodle: That’s who it
was. Angelo Martinelli was the
referee.
Chappell: So you hung in
there with Roop…which I don’t
think anybody expected going in.
Kernodle: I wrestled him
really, really good, and I guess
we went close to the ten minute
mark. The heat in the studio
really got to me as the match
went on. He put a front face
lock on me…and I didn’t even
know what a front face lock was!
I was power lifting back then,
and my forehead hit the mat…but
I was still on my feet. I stood
back up with him on three
different occasions.
Chappell: Was there a big
size difference between you two?
Kernodle: He weighed 285,
and I weighed like 220 or 225.
Chappell: A big
difference…
Kernodle: But he was a
lot better wrestler than me…by
far. And eventually, he put some
kind of hold on me. It wasn’t
the sugar hold, but I had to
give up, or I felt like he was
gonna break my neck. I held out
as long as I could.
Chappell: Sounds like a
heck of a match on your part.
Kernodle: I was
exhausted. I either had to give
up, or he was gonna hurt me.
Hurt me pretty bad, I thought. I
couldn’t do anything; I was
exhausted. So I gave up, and the
match was over.
Chappell: What happened
when you left the ring?
Kernodle: I left through
the doors back to the dressing
room, and Ole and Gene Anderson
were standing there. They knew
[Roop] was wrestling a mark that
night, but they didn’t know it
was me. But like I said, I had
met them before.
Chappell: Did they say
anything to you?
Kernodle: They said,
“Kid, man, you almost beat him;
you almost beat him. That was
great.” Then Ole looked at me
and said, “I tell you what I’m
gonna do…I’m gonna break you
into the business.” He told me
to be at the YMCA in Charlotte
at 9:00 Monday morning.
Chappell: Unbelievable!
Kernodle: He said, “This
will be the hardest thing you’ve
ever done.” He told me he wasn’t
gonna punch me and he wasn’t
gonna break my bones, but that
it would be the hardest thing
I’d ever done.
He said that if I said “I quit”
or “I give up,” that there would
be no questions asked and I’d
get my ass in that car and go
back to Burlington.
Chappell: Ole being his
usual tactful self!
Bourne: (laughs)
Kernodle: I told Ole and
Gene I’d do it. They didn’t
charge me anything. So, I was up
at the YMCA at 9:00 on Monday
morning.
Chappell: After the match
with Roop, did anybody else at
WRAL talk to you about your
performance?
Kernodle: I remember
Jerry Brisco saying something.
Chappell: Did Roop say
anything to you after the match?
Kernodle: I didn’t see
Roop after the match. They did a
deal where he turned on
Thunderbolt Patterson…it
happened in Dorton Arena. It got
so much heat that the people
almost broke down the dressing
room doors. And [Roop] got the
heck out of here.
Chappell: Roop didn’t
hang around the territory very
long.
Kernodle: That’s what I’m
saying. He got scared…he got the
hell out of here! So, he left.
Thunderbolt was over…couldn’t
wrestle a lick!
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: But he was over
with the people…
Chappell: He could talk!
Kernodle: Yes, he could
talk. It was a hot angle, and it
really got out of hand. We would
talk about it for months after
that.
I never saw Bob Roop again until
1979. I was wrestling for Dory
and Terry Funk in Amarillo. And
Terry got me in that movie with
Sylvester Stallone…Paradise
Alley.
Bourne: Right!
Kernodle: I had done my
part, and I was sittin’ on the
bleachers there in that bar on
the set, and somebody came and
tapped me on the shoulder and I
looked up and it was Roop!
Chappell: Bet you were a
little surprised!
Kernodle: Roop says, “You
look like that guy I wrestled in
Raleigh that night.”
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: I said, ‘That’s
me.’ Roop said, “I want to tell
you something. If you had lasted
10 more seconds, you would have
beat me.”
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Chappell: Well, it was
probably true!
Kernodle: I was gone,
brother! I was out. I mean, I
was exhausted. I couldn’t do
anything. It was either give up,
or go to the hospital!
Chappell: Well, it was
still good of Roop to compliment
you…even though it was six years
later!
Kernodle: And I haven’t
seen Roop since, really.
Bourne: He’s gonna be in
Charlotte this summer, at
Fanfest!
Kernodle: I heard that.
Chappell: I hope you all
will get together…that would be
a great photo opt!
Well, it’s great to have you
tell us about the match with
Roop, because I’ve heard several
versions of what happened over
the years.
Kernodle: Yeah…some
stories say that I beat him. I
heard that…but I didn’t beat
him. He beat me. But we went a
long time, close to the time
limit. And he’d beaten everybody
else in less than 20 seconds.
But he beat me.
Chappell: Was it strictly
a scientific match?
Kernodle: It was all
amateur wrestling. It was shoot
wrestling. He shot with me in an
amateur way. But if I hadn’t
given up, I believe he would
have hurt me.
Bourne: He wasn’t working
with you at all?
Kernodle: (laughs) Oh,
no! You see, guys, think about
it. He had everything to lose.
His reputation was high, and I
was just a little ol’ kid. I was
twenty-three, trying to get into
wrestling.
I wouldn’t do anything like
that, myself, personally…
Chappell: It’s amazing to
me that Jim Crockett Promotions,
and Roop, would do something
like that. It just blows my
mind! What’s the upside for
them?
Kernodle: Well, David,
you remember Tim Woods did
something like that down in
Georgia…
Chappell: Yeah, and he
got his finger bitten off for
his trouble!
Kernodle: And Tim Woods
was also a great amateur
wrestler, but yeah, he got his
finger bit off by a biker. But
after that, he beat the crap out
of the guy!
Woods was just trying to play
with him a little bit…you know,
roll around with him a little
bit. And then the guy bit his
finger off!
Chappell: Makes no sense
in my opinion…for Roop to do
that.
Kernodle: In a situation
like that, the [professional
wrestler] has a lot to lose…and
nothing to gain.
Chappell: Now, when Ole
and Gene approached you after
the match…were they doing that
on their own or were they doing
it on behalf of Jim Crockett
Promotions?
Kernodle: That was Ole
and Gene. Like I said, I had
talked to them before, and they
knew I had wrestled at Elon.
Bourne: Ole always had a
healthy respect for anybody with
a legitimate amateur background.
Kernodle: And I actually
favored Ole back then! I don’t
know if ya’ll ever noticed it,
or not. But at one time I was
thinking about becoming “Donnie
Anderson.”
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: Donnie Anderson
was a football player…
Chappell: I think he may
have played for the [Green Bay]
Packers.
Kernodle: But Ole and
Gene said that everybody knew me
from amateur wrestling, so it
would probably be better for me
to keep my real name. Now, I’m
glad I did.
Bourne: Well, that let
them put you over as the local
guy…which they did. I remember
hearing that all the time.
Chappell: On TV you were
always talked about as hailing
from Elon College in Burlington,
North Carolina.
Could you describe your training
under Gene and Ole.
Kernodle: I’d go up [to
Charlotte] on Monday, Tuesday
and Wednesday and work out with
them…
Chappell: Tell us about
that first Monday! Was it as bad
as advertised?
Kernodle: Oh man! It was!
It was hot, too! They ran me
about five miles. Run up and
down all the steps over there at
Charlotte…at the Shriners
Football Stadium. You know,
where they had North
Carolina/South Carolina play.
Pretty big stadium…
Bourne: Right behind the
Park Center…
Kernodle: Exactly. Pretty
big stadium. I’d run up and down
all the steps. 500 jumping
jacks. At that point I’d already
helped put up the ring. Vomited
five or six times…I was just
unbelievably worn out!
Chappell: Was anybody
else training you?
Kernodle: Terry Sawyer
was there. Terry Sawyer was a
GREAT amateur wrestler.
Chappell: From down in
Tidewater Virginia.
Kernodle: Granby High
School. He was only 190-200
pounds, but he wrestled for
Granby High School, and that
school has the greatest record
of any high school in the United
States. Billy Martin, Sr. was
the wrestling coach there.
But Terry Sawyer was great…he
never got tired!
Chappell: What did the
three of them do with you in the
ring?
Kernodle: What they would
do, if I got down or had to
switch or get away from them,
they’d make me get right back
down. They just wore me out!
They’d make
me run the ropes, and then I
didn’t know how to run the
ropes. I was just hittin’ them
hard, and brother that lat back
there…man, that thing was like a
boil!
Chappell: Brutal!
Kernodle: Runnin’ the
ropes…I’d collapse! Just
collapsed right there in the
middle of the ring. Just
exhausted.
So Ole was right…he said it’d be
the toughest thing I’d ever
done.
Bourne: I guess they’re
wanting to see if you can take
it. Did they stretch you?
Kernodle: Stretch?? They
stretched me all the way back to
Burlington!!
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: I mean…they
were trying to get you to quit.
They were trying to see if you
had enough fortitude not to
quit, not to give up.
Chappell: So there was a
method to their madness.
Kernodle: If everybody
had to get in the professional
wrestling business like me, I
hate to say this in a bad way,
but some of the riffraff that’s
in there…wouldn’t be in there.
Believe me!
Bourne: Yeah, like all
these backyard guys…who think
they’re wrestlers!
Kernodle: Then later on
somebody who weighs 200 pounds
and could buy some tights and a
pair of boots, thought they were
a professional wrestler.
But, that’s
the reason why amateur wrestlers
like me don’t like to see
riffraff in the business. They
think you have to pay your way
into the business…which is good.
Chappell: Don, you
certainly paid your dues!
Kernodle: When Ole said
it would be the toughest thing
you’ve ever done…he was right.
It was unbelievable.
College wrestling training is
hard…but nothing compared to
what Ole and Gene put me
through.
Chappell: How long did
you train with Ole and Gene?
Kernodle: I did that for
probably about eight weeks.
Chappell: How did you
make it that long?!
Kernodle: (laughs) What I
would do is when I would run,
and I’d be tired as could be,
but when I got around there next
to Ole and Gene, when I’d run by
them, I’d act like I wasn’t
tired!
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: Then finally
Gene would say, “Kid, no use us
runnin’ you no more.”
Chappell/Bourne:
(laughing)
Kernodle: So, they didn’t
run me any more.
Chappell: I guess they
worked you early in the week
because Charlotte was the Monday
stop?
Kernodle: Yeah, they
worked Charlotte on Monday. Then
on Tuesday, I think they were in
Columbia, but they were also in
Raleigh and they had a little
time. And on Wednesday, they had
TV in Raleigh. If it didn’t work
in their schedule, they’d do it
another day.
Chappell: Did anybody
else train with you?
Kernodle: I had a buddy
that went with me, but when he
saw what they did to me…he
wouldn’t even get in the ring!
He was a tough guy, and we did
judo together.
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